Lost 4.07: Ji YeonWow. Way to make me cry, Lost writers. While this episode seemed to lack in a lot of things going on (many ongoing threads were sort of thrown by the wayside) it made up for it with that scene between Sayid and Desmond and the captain, and the big twist at the end. I really liked this one.
Those old flashforwards ain’t what they used to be...
Previously on Lost...
On my blog, last week’s episode seemed to generate more chatter about who would be revealed on the boat this week than anything that had happened in “The Other Woman.” So let’s go straight to “Ji Yeon.”
Episode Recap:
Okay, maybe it’s because I just had a baby in September (‘One day after the third anniversary of the Oceanic crash,’ says Her Nerdliness), but the end of this episode had me weeping. On the freighter, Desmond and Sayid wander around and meet the captain, and when they’re finally given their quarters, they are introduced to the janitor, who is – Shock! Gasp! Ohmigod! – Michael. Meanwhile, in the island, Sun no longer trusts Daniel and Charlotte after last week’s weirdness, so she wants to defect to Locke’s side of the camp. The flash shows Sun off the island (one of the Oceanic Six) and her husband, Jin, apparently rushing to her side to give her a giant panda. But when the end finally comes, we realize, for the first time, we were watching one flashforward (Sun’s) and one flashback (Jin’s). He wasn’t there. It was only Sun who made it off the island. Sniffle.
Clues that Jin’s flash was in the past:
• Sun makes a big deal about them not removing her ring at the hospital.
• Jin’s giant cellphone.
• When Jin tries to buy the second panda, the storekeeper offers him a dragon, saying in the Year of the Dragon it’s good luck. The Year of the Dragon was 2001, and the next one isn’t until 2012.
• Bernard explains what karma is to Jin, that if you do something bad, something bad happens to you.
• Sun telling Jin that she thought she’d lost him, and him saying she’ll never lose him.
Highlights:
• Jin telling Jack that Sawyer has been helping him with his English, but Sun is better.
• The look on Desmond’s face when the captain tells him that Widmore is behind the freighter.
• Hurley seeing Ji Yeon and saying, “She’s awesome.”
• That ending.
Biggest “GASP!” Moments:
• Sun and Jin BOTH made it off the island!! YAY! So they are the fifth and sixth members of the Oceanic Six.
• Juliet telling Jin that Sun had an affair. My jaw almost hit my lap. On the one hand, she achieved her goal at keeping Sun close by, but on the other hand, at what cost? She risked their marriage, and the child potentially being brought up by a single parent. Way to get Sun’s trust there, Juliet.
• Wait... Jin’s is a flashBACK?
• Hurley showing up at Sun’s door.
• Jin didn’t make it off the island. He’s not one of the Oceanic Six. And... he died the day of the crash, according to his tombstone.
Biggest Non-GASP Moment:
Michael is on the boat.
Hurley’s Numbers:
The license plate on the taxi that drives away with Jin’s first panda is 2369. (First number is 23 and the second is 23 times 3.)
Did You Notice?:
• Regina is reading Jules Verne’s Survivors of the Chancellor. This is a book about a ship lost at sea, written in the form of a diary by one of the people on board. Throughout the book people die or commit suicide by jumping off the ship, and the ones who don’t die are cannibalized by the others. Perhaps the book gave Regina the idea?
• In the first flashforward, when Sun is packing a suitcase, that episode of Exposé that featured Nikki is on the television (it’s at the scene just before the Cobra shoots her, and it’s being dubbed in Korean).
• “Panda diplomacy,” something that’s no longer practiced, was where China would give a panda to another country as a show of friendship, because of the extreme rarity of the animals. This is probably why it’s important to Paik to give a panda, and not another animal.
• One of my complaints about this show in the early seasons was, what exactly do those people talk about around the campfire? Clearly it’s not THEIR LIVES, or they’d actually know a little bit about each other. Bernard finally opening up to Jin and telling him about Rose’s cancer was a moment where one character actually tells something personal to another. It almost never happens on this show.
• The freighter is the “Kahana,” meaning it’s a Hawaiian ship.
• Zoe Bell (Regina) actually made that jump off the ship. Acting isn’t her first profession: she’s a stuntwoman, most notably for Lucy Lawless on Xena.
• Both Regina and Captain Gault are Australian.
• The blood spatter on the wall of the quarters looked like the one Radzinsky left in the Swan station.
• One side effect of getting pregnant on the island appears to be losing all the baby weight only days after having the child. (A nitpick I have with the majority of television births; that and the fact the doctor says, “Oh, it’s time to push!” and she pushes for about 20 seconds and out comes baby, rather than the more traditional hour or more for a first child. Ahem.)
• I think if we were to put the flashforwards into a timeline, Sun’s happens first, and Kate’s comes around the same time or shortly after, followed by Hurley’s, where he ends up in an institution, and then after Jack seems so together in Kate’s and Hurley’s, he loses it and his happens last.
So Many Questions...
• What the heck was going on between Keamy and Frank at the beginning? Frank looks squirrelly when Keamy asks him if he’s ready, and says he’ll be up later. For what?
• Can Desmond remember anything since 1996? There’s no indication in here of whether or not he remembers anyone from the island yet. At one point Sayid mentions being in Locke’s camp and Ben saying there was a spy on the boat. Desmond doesn’t say, “Who is Ben?” or “Who is Locke?” so either Sayid’s been filling him in, or he remembers.
• What’s the problem they had in the kitchen? (Oh, and if all there were to eat were lima beans, I’d starve.)
• Any Korean translators out there who could tell me what Ji Yeon means?
• Who was banging the pipes on the freighter?
• What’s up with that doctor on the ship? Is he really a doctor? He totally creeps me out. When they’re walking to their new “quarters” Sayid says the ship isn’t moving, and the doc says, “Well, if you say so.” What did that mean? Is it moving? Is that some reference to time travel?
• What made Regina jump from the freighter all of a sudden?
• Where did Frank take the helicopter? Did his “errand” have anything to do with what Keamy wanted to discuss with him at the beginning of the episode?
• The captain says that it’s the close proximity to the island that’s making people go batty. What on the island could be causing madness on the ship? How long has the ship been there? You don’t develop cabin fever by being on a boat for a week.
• I’ve seen fan speculation that maybe the wreckage of Flight 815 that had been found was the actual plane and everyone really did die, and what we’re seeing on the island is their lives in Heaven or Purgatory or Hell (despite Darlton shooting down the Purgatory idea), but finally, the captain puts all that to rest and reveals that yes indeedy, that wreckage was entirely staged. So... who staged it? To paraphrase the captain, who would go to such lengths?
• “And that... is just one of the many reasons why we want Benjamin Linus.” What did HE have to do with the wreckage? Could he have staged it? How?
• So... is Michael Ben’s man on the boat? Or does he just happen to be on the boat? Is he faking them out by pretending to be Kevin Johnson, or does he actually believe that to be true? Did he go nuts after killing two people, shooting himself in the arm, and then selling out his friends? Or did he feel so guilty that he’s back for restitution?
• When Hurley asks Sun if the others are coming (presumably meaning the rest of the Six) and she says no, he says, “Good.” Why? Are the others the ones putting the pressure on them to keep quiet and he’d rather not be around them?
• So... was Jin killed off because Daniel Dae Kim was busted with a DUI? (The curse continues...)
• Why didn’t the rest of the Six come to see Sun?
• The date on the tombstone was September 22, 2004, the date of the plane crash. Is Jin’s body really buried there, or is it a memorial stone? Jack lies on the witness stand in Kate’s flashforward that eight people survived the crash, but only six made it off the island. Perhaps Jin is one of the eight, and they brought his body back? Or could he actually still be alive, on the island, and Sun left to save the baby? Or are Sun and Jin faking his death to keep him safe from Paik? I’d like to believe Jin is alive.
• Damon and Carlton said we’d know all of the Six by the end of the seventh episode. This is the seventh, which means Aaron must be one of the Six. I still think that seems wrong; he wasn’t on the manifest. So if Jack is saying that only 8 survived the plane crash, and 6 of them made it back, wouldn’t people assume that Claire was one of the 8, then she had Aaron, died, and then two other people died to bring the number down to 6? It seems like wonky math to me.
Next week: As the voiceover said, “Someone . . . will . . . die.”
UPDATES: So it's been established by Damon Lindelof that Desmond got all his current memories back after talking with Juliet (and I'd read that interview, too... my bad). So the question is, would he have even known Michael? Correct me if I'm wrong, because I could totally be wrong, but he's not around when Desmond shows up at the beginning of the season, he's with the tailies. Then when Des comes back at the end of the season, Michael's on his way to the other side of the island. So was Desmond's look of non-recognition genuine, or did he meet him and I'm just not remembering it?
Secondly: A few people have put forth that Michael is actually the sixth member of the Oceanic Six. But just because we've seen him doesn't mean he's one of the Six. Couldn't the same be said for any of the people we've actually seen on the island? I believe the Six can only be known for sure because they've been seen in flashforwards, and the producers said we'll have seen all six in flashforwards by this episode, and since we haven't seen Michael, presumably, then we haven't seen all six.
Now, I'm still of the mind that he's the guy in the coffin in Jack's flashforward, and if you'll recall, in the obituary the guy in the coffin went by another name. In this episode we saw that Michael was using a pseudonym, so perhaps he still is later. And if he'd actually been one of the Oceanic Six, then his death would have been front-page news, not some small obit near the back of the paper. He probably gets off the island, but I'd suggest he's not one of the six. But that's just my theory at this point.
UPDATE #2: My husband just watched it, and he suggested that maybe the tombstone had been erected BEFORE Sun actually returned! I'd never thought of that, but if the announcement had gone out that Jin and Sun were dead, someone could have erected tombstones for both of them and then Sun's death date was taken off once it was clear that she was alive. That's another possibility of why it had the plane's crash date on it.
UPDATE #3: Sorry, guys, I went away for the weekend and got there to discover no Internet... gah! Anyway, while I was away from the computer for a couple of days, I was thinking about what someone had posted, that maybe Regina was upset because her lover was Naomi, and that she was the R.G. on the bracelet. Then I was thinking, is there any possibility it's the captain? His last name is Gault, and they don't mention his first name, which might have been intentional... oops, and now that I just began reading through the comments I haven't yet seen, I saw that Barry brought up the same thing!
Also, I put in my column that the captain and Regina are both Australians, when Regina is clearly a New Zealander. Oops... sorry, I hope I didn't tick off any Kiwis. As a Canadian, I shouldn't have made that egregious error...
UPDATE #4: I'm just going through the comments now, and someone has stated Ji Yeon was the last episode before the break. I just wanted to clarify that next week's episode, "Meet Kevin Johnson" is a new one, and IT is the last one before the break.
OHMYGOD OHMYGOD!!!
ReplyDeleteLast night's episode was insane. Michael has a twin brother named Kevin Johnson?! Why do they have different last names? THIS IS INSANE.
Also, Korean boys AND girls love Pandas. WTF?!?!?!?
So many questions, so much confusion.
I'm glad they seem to be counting Aaron as one of the 6. I understand this "he wasn't on the manifest" argument, but to me that just seems silly. Imagine that six folks from the plane were rescued, along with a baby born while they were on the island. Can you really believe that the media would refer to them as the Oceanic 6 (plus the baby)?? No, they would be given the moniker the Oceanic 7, because the media would focus on the rescue, not the manifest!
ReplyDeleteJonathan: HAHAHAHA!!
ReplyDeleteEric: I see what you're saying, and it's a really good point. I think what we've been saying doesn't pan out, though, is Kate being overprotective of him in Eggtown, where the lawyer said we should bring him in because we need to tell the jury what you did and she's all, "NO! NOT MY SON!"
If he were one of the celebrated and super-famous Oceanic Six, then wouldn't all of the papers have had the whole story, had his face splashed all over them, and it wouldn't be a surprise to any jury?? That's what doesn't make sense. I do think if he were openly rescued, then obviously he's one of the Six. But Kate acting like he's some massive secret made it sound like she smuggled him off the island and no one knew about him, and he'd be some big secret they were all harboring.
I've always assumed that that is precisely what did happen when the 6 got home, when Aaron was something like 4 months old, and that that experience is part of why Kate refuses to put him through that again now that he is 2-3 years old and a bit more able to comprehend what is going on.
ReplyDeleteI was so sad. I was watching it with a friend. I kept telling him how sad I was that Jin was dead, and he said,
ReplyDelete"Well, imagine how Sun feels."
:-)
But seriously, heartbreaking. Although I knew as soon as he said he wanted to name the girl Ji-Yeon that that was the end of Jin. It was kind of Hindi-movie-ish. However, I kept waiting, waiting, hoping he'd show up at the hospital even though I knew he wouldn't. That's the power of good writing and editing. And acting. And seeing Hurley was brilliant too.
I will read the column and respond to it soon. I just wanted to say what I felt to get it off my chest.
*Weep*
And we don't know if Jin died on the island or off the island... If that was just a memorial or if he's actually buried there...
ReplyDeleteI think I'll just count Jin & Aaron, together, as one of the Oceanic Six.
Can anyone help me with a flash-forward timeline? Sun was ultrasounded at 8 weeks, meaning she's 9-10 weeks along at last night's episode. Juliet told her she had to leave the island within 3 weeks. Delivery is normally at 40 weeks. The baby looked to be full term, if not older by TV standards. Just trying to pinpoint a the date when they get rescued.
ReplyDeleteAlso where does Sayid's FF fit into the timeline?
I'm glad this show is going until 2010. The producers need 2.5 years to tie up all of the loose ends.
Actually, who's to say that Jin is dead? Just because there's a tombstone doesn't mean he's dead. There's an old question in the world of comics... "Did you see the body?". For all we know, Sun could be lying about him being dead just like Jack lied about there being eight survivors. Jin could still be on the island with the others, that Jack wants to go back for.
ReplyDeleteDid Sun say anything at the tombstone to suggest Jin was *actually* dead? Or just "i miss you and wish you were here" stuff that could apply to Jin being left behind on the island or dead?
ReplyDeleteEric: Hmm... good point. You've almost got me convinced! :) I agree she'd want to shelter him now that he's older, but the lawyer's words still don't make a lot of sense, if the rescue and what Kate had done was really put forth in the media.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous: I think Sun delivered prematurely, or else she wouldn't have called the hospital and said something was wrong, she simply would have said she'd gone into labour. So maybe she gave birth at around 35 weeks or something, and they could have been rescued any time before that.
ReplyDeleteI liked last night's episode but not as much as the last few. It wasn't filled with the GASP moments that I love. I knew that Jin's were flashbacks the minute I saw them - just a gut feeling at first, but when I saw his phone, I knew. Therefore, the end wasn't a gasp moment for me. It was interesting to see that there is a "grave" for him but I knew that he hadn't made it off the island. Of course, we still don't know if he's dead - maybe he's still on the island. The Michael reveal was also interesting in that he is "Kevin Johnson" (does he know Sayid or has something changed?) but there was no GASP.
ReplyDeletePeter: I addressed this in my column.
ReplyDeleteCrissy: No, I don't think so, she just talks about him like he's not here, which is why I'd like to hope he's still on the island and not dead. :)
All I can say is NOOOOOOOO!!! Not Jin!!! Damn those DUI's!!!
ReplyDeleteI was really emotional watching the episode last night. I've always thought Jin and Sun had amazing chemistry together.
Best moments:
- When I screamed WTF when Jin was in the hospital and realized that it was a flashback, those wicked SOB's! Looking back, the juxtaposition of Jin's FB and Sun's FF was brilliant, and heartbreaking
- Jin forgiving Sun...forgiveness is the kiss of death on lost, sigh...
- Sun slapping Juliet...the nerve of that Other divulging secrets like that!
Questions:
- Is Jin really dead? I REALLY hope he is part of this Oceanic 6coverup. The trailers lead us to believe that we will learn HOW he dies next week, but as long as we do not see the killing scene and the body, I am in DENIAL about his death....HE IS NOT DEAD!!! *wink* The date of the death on the tombstone REALLY makes me think he isn't!
- Who's blood stain? What if it belongs to Lapidus, he disappeared mysteriously in the copter, what if he was killed for knowing too much? And he is the death next week?
- Has Ben kidnapped Walt once again? And Michael is working for Ben in the same way Future Sayid is working for him?
Thoroughly enjoyable episode, I liked it much more than the Juliet one!
This was brought up on another blog, and I think I agree, Michael is the 6th "Oceanic 6" survivor. He was the only other character introduced last night...and last week's promo said that the rest of the Oceanic 6 "would be revealed," didn't they?
ReplyDeleteIf we know Sayid is on the freighter and one of the 6, it would stand to reason that Michael is also 'saved' and brought back to the 'real world.'
This was the weepiest episode yet, for me. Out-and-out bawling for the last 5 minutes.
I just read your whole post. There was a recent article on Entertainment Weekly that answered this question you had:
ReplyDelete"Can Desmond remember anything since 1996? There’s no indication in here of whether or not he remembers anyone from the island yet."
I wish I still had the link. Anyway, the interviewer asked one Lindelof about this very thing. He said that once Desmond found his constant, he changed his memories beginning from 1996 to the present. So, yes, he does remember everything...and more. It is now a changed timeline. Lindelof said that in the previous 1996 Desmond never met with Dan Farraday at Oxford. And this is supposed to make us think about how/why Desmond made it to the island. That he possibly *knew* he needed to end up on the island in order to 'meet' Farraday in the future.
Anyway, thought you'd be interested to know that.
jonathan, I think you are confused. He doesn't have a twin. He is using an alias and pretending not to know Sayid and Desmond. I guess it wasn't as obvious as I thought. LOL
ReplyDeleteThis show is really pissing me off!
ReplyDeleteI remember when I was a kid and I’d be at home during summer vacation during which I would sometimes sit with my Mother and watch her soap operas with her. I could never understand why she was so invested in these shows. Like these characters were real people to her. Why what happened to them had any meaning to her. Now I truly understand. I feel kind of stupid for taking a TV show to heart like this but damned if I could help myself. This is the only show that I’ve ever watched every episode of when it originally aired. The only one that I have followed religiously. I’m invested in it. I’m loyal to it. In the end, I want a happy ending to this show and for its characters. For me, it's really hard to think of a happy ending where Jin is dead. This sucks.
When Boone died, whatever, I didn’t like him anyway. Artz was annoying and not one of the originals anyway so who cares. Shannon, while pleasing to the eye, was really just a waste of space. Ana-Lucia and Libby, I just didn’t care about them. Eko, I liked Eko but it really didn’t matter that he’s gone. Charlie…If I were a crier than I would have been bawling!!!! Last night, once again if I were a crier, I would have been bawling! Jin is one of my favorite characters and I really wanted Him and Sun to make it off the island and have their kid and be happily married until they were old. Watching Sun at the end of the episode (Yunjin Kim was great), with Hurley standing there (how cool was it that he came), just left a pit in the bottom of my stomach. I was speechless.
Ok, enough of this sentimental crud.
Here are my thoughts:
-I think the Captain was implying that Ben staged the fake plane. It made sense to me. Finding the plane ends the search, which is what I think Ben wanted. Remember that he’s trying to keep the island hidden from the outside world and not having people look for the survivors would aid in him this.
-Nikki, someone, help me out here. I thought I’ve heard somewhere that when someone is widowed they move their wedding rings to a different finger. Maybe that’s just for the guys but I’m not certain. Sun has her ring on her left ring finger. I’m hoping that maybe, just a glimmer of hope, Jin’s still alive and on the isalnd.
-Jack said that initially eight survived that crash but only six made it home alive. If Jin is dead, was he one of the two that died before they were rescued? Is his body really buried in that cemetery? If Aaron is one the six, then wouldn’t Jack have said that seven initailly survived and that later on the baby was born, which would make him the sixth (or eighth?)?
-I’m fairly certain that Desmond recognized Michael and was playing along with Sayid which would indicate that his memory is fine.
-If the people on the freighter now all about the survivors then wouldn’t they have information on Michael?
-During the episode, when Jin’s flashback started, I had a feeling that it was a flashback or that he wasn’t with Sun anymore and that he was getting the panda for someone else.
-I’m guessing that had Kate would have been there for Sun had she could have been. It probably would have been difficult considering she was incarcerated, on trial and then made the deal, which stated she couldn’t leave. Sayid’s off killing for Ben, which probably explains his absence. Jack is just a whole different person off the island so I’m not surprised that he wasn’t there. As for the sixth person, I don’t believe that it’s Aaron, I’m at a loss!
Yikes. Just had a freaky thought. What if "Michael" is really a grown up Walt? Not sure how that could be, but with the time travel stuff going on...?
ReplyDeleteBut that would be pretty damn masterful, if the writers could make that work. No one was surprised that "Michael" was the spy on the boat...which seems a bit sloppy of the writers. But if he were "Walt"...
HOLY CRAP!
Hey guys,
ReplyDeleteLet me just put these tissues away...okay, much better. Wow, that episode was sad at the end, but brilliant all the same.
First off, the idea of mixing a flashback with a flashforward is pure genius, and the writing for this show just continues to be top notch each week.
Now on to my thoughts:
Now that Michael is under the name of Kevin Johnson, was he brainwashed somehow? He looked sincere about not knowing Sayid and Desmond, but hey, he's probably just acting and putting on a show for the doctor, right? RIGHT?
So now the full roster of the Oceanic Six have been revealed, establishing the fact that Aaron does not count since he was not born before the flight. I'm very interested in seeing the future of the six, and how they all meet up.
The Captain made a very good point about how much money and secrecy must go in to staging a plane crash, and now we know the dead bodies there are, in fact, real people. That's just horrific, man. As the cap said, 324 families were destroyed, seemingly all because of good ol' Benjamin Linus...or is it?
My favorite scenes: The ending (duh), and Juliet's talk with Sun about how the pregnant women die. Very disturbing, and very important for the character of Juliet, since here she shows her sincere concern for Sun, and that she truly has become one of the survivors.
So now the big mystery, other than Michael, is how does Jin meet his untimely end? I'm betting that once he and Sun returned to society, Mr. Paik jumped right back on their trail and finished Jin off. You'd think the guy would cut them a break since Jin gave him a granddaughter, but would he? After all, at the end of season one (in a flashback), Jin is seen in the airport bathroom where he meets an associate of Mr. Paik's who knows that Jin is trying to escape from his hellish job. I think this is reasonable since there is no way Jin and Sun could hide from the kind of publicity of the Oceanic Six.
The most disturbing moment? Uh, what is going on with this "advanced cabin fever"? Good God, crew members are jumping off ships and shooting themselves in the head! This island is becoming more and more creepy with each reveal.
Man, I have to mention that final scene again. That was just so well done. Hurley is obviously happy nobody else is showing up because he wants to get away from the fact that he "has to go back". In the future, Hurley is constantly being haunted by the now-past island events, and Charlie's death. That's some serious trauma. This scene also shows that Hurley seemingly cares the most about his fellow survivors. I mean, only HE makes the effort to travel thousands of miles to visit Jin and see Jin Yeon? What the heck happens on that island?
To top it all off, I don't know about you, but I got pretty choked up when Sun was telling Jin's grave about the baby and the delivery. That's just from the heart, man. Oh...excuse me (blows nose).
At least this depressing episode had some great humor! I laughed out loud when Jin ran after the taxi and yelled that he would find that guy and rip his head off. That was awesome, and so was the look on his face. He was all like "I NEED A PANDA!" You can't make this stuff up, which leads me to my other theory that this is all based off of true events (just joking, or, what if...nevermind)
All in all, chalk up another great episode to the "LOST" library, my friends.
- Brandon
Great episoe last night! I have to agree with everyone about Jin. I don't believe he is dead. I'm guessing he's still on the island with other survivors. I saw that on a couple of sites that the date of his death was 9/22/04. According to that date he died from the plane crash instead of being one of the eight that Kate helped ashore, shelter, feed etc..., I have a feeling Sun knows that he's still there and is hoping that he'll return somehow.
ReplyDeleteI don't trust the captain about Ben staging the second plane because when Sayid and Desmond landed on the freighter the one guy that came out to meet Frank didn't seem to all that happy that he brought back Sayid. Kinda seems to mess up Widmore/Abbadon (Whoever is in charge) plan to rid the island of all survivors by gassing them. Like I mentioned in an earlier post, these guys went to a lot of trouble to do all this and all of the sudden 6 survivors show up. I think Faraday had a change of heart, he said to Charlotte "I don't think I can do this." Maybe he meant gassing the survivors instead of figuring out how to release the gas.
About Michael, I am almost certain that Sayid knows that's Michael and Michael knows that it's Sayid. I think Michael was hoping that Sayid would be cool and not blow his cover. Sayid knows that there is something bad about the crew on the freighter. If there is chance of figuring anything out he needs all the advantages he can get. I'm sure Michael feels the same way.
I'll bet the people on the frieghter had a copy of the manifest of 815 and somehow Michael realized that and he had to lie about who he is to protect himself and Walt.
Michael was hesitant to go over and clean the room with Sayid and Desmond standing there. It was obivious that he didn't want them to see him.
ReplyDeleteSeriously, if there hadn't had been all this media attention about Michael returning to the show and then having his name appear in the credits for every episode this season, would we have guessed that Michael was the spy? Or on the freighter? It's the only reason I beleived him to be the spy. I wouldn't have considered it otherwise.
I think the writers expect us to figure some things out. We all theorized that Locke's dad was the real Sawyer since seaon one. Claire was Jack's brother since season two. They put the math out there so all we got to do is add it together.
They have done flashbacks. They have done flashforwards. They have done flashbacks that looks like dejavu and time-travel (Flashes Before Your Eyes / The Constant). They have done flashbacks that looks like jolted memories (Maternity Leave). They have done episodes which is entirely on-island flashbacks (The Other 48 Days / Three Minutes / The Brig). They have done off and on-island flashbacks together (Expose). They have done flashbacks and flashforwards from different character's point of views (Exodus). They have mixed flashbacks and flashforwards in a single episode (Ji Yeon).
ReplyDeleteI can't wait to see what's next.
Damn clever writers.
Roland: Great insights, as usual! I never thought that blood stain could be Frank's!! Good idea... I LOVE Frank, I certainly hope it's not him. :( But now that they've taken my Jin... wah.
ReplyDeleteKristin: I agree... I started crying when Sun opened the door to Hurley, and didn't stop until the credits rolled. (OK, I'm lying... until about 5 minutes after the credits rolled.)
Oh, and last night as I was just about to fall asleep, it suddenly occurred to me that Damon had said Des had his memories back. D'oh! Thanks for mentioning it. :)
christemple: I think Jonathan was kidding. :)
crackedout: What a lovely post!! I agree with it 100%. When I brought out my Buffy book, a lot of fans were surprised when they read it and emailed me to say, "It actually sounds like you're a big fan of the show... are you?" Then I'd meet some in person and they'd always say the same thing. It baffled me at first, until I started looking at other episode guides and they looked like they were written for hire. How could anyone spend this much time writing about a show they didn't love?
ReplyDeleteBut it's true... I'm supposed to be looking at this from a professional standpoint, but at the end of the day, I'm just as drooly as the next fan, and I love it. I love that I've become so invested in these characters they can make me cry. Thank God Hurley is one of the Oceanic Six, because I couldn't handle him not making it.
Re: Ring on finger. I think it's a personal decision. Many people leave their wedding bands intact for years after their spouse dies. Often they move it to another finger only when they're open to another relationship. Other people remove it. Some keep it on that ring finger even after starting a new relationship. It's totally up to the individual, I would suspect.
Re: Kate not coming. I'm assuming as soon as she got back she was pegged as Kate the wanted fugitive, and while awaiting trial she was unable to leave the country.
Kristin: Interesting theory about Walt and Michael!!
ReplyDeleteBrandon: Another nice post! I don't think Paik could have finished Jin off, as you say, because if he'd returned with Sun, he would have been one of the Six, and instead, they're letting on he died in the crash, as per his tombstone.
Steve Gee: Good points!!
crackedout: I agree with you... sometimes I wish things could fly under the radar. But in this day and age, it's next to impossible. It's why JJ Abrams' trailer for Cloverfield showing up in theaters when no one knew he was working on the film was such an astounding feat.
mw: Well put! I, too, am on the edge of my seat from now to the end. I think they can put to rest any fears they had about knowing when the end game is... now that Darlton know how many eps are left, they are on fire!
I read this on another site, so I cannot take credit for this one!
ReplyDeleteNaomi's bracelet, "I'll always be with you, RG". What if R is Regina and she was distraught about Naomi and decided to kill herself? I guess she could have gone nuts ala Minkowski but she didn't seem to have the bleeding nose when she was reading the book upside down, just totally out of it...
Has anyone translated Jin's tombstone? What did it say?!!! I don't believe he's dead either. At least I don't want to. I have a vague memory of Jack alluding to something "bad" the Oceanic 6 did before leaving the island, could this be a reason for Jin to stay behind. Sun didn't actually say he was dead, but Hurley said the baby looked like Jin, and perhaps they should go visit him, then they went to the cemetary, if Jin isn't dead why would they go there?
ReplyDeleteThat phone gave the whole story away! I used to have an old Nokia that looked like that, so it was obvious it was a flashback. Also the shopkeeper said something about the Year of the Dragon and I made a mental note to find out when the last year of the dragon was!! As it happened it didn't matter!
The Panda made sense when we found out that it was for the grandson of the Chinese Ambassador, and hardly surprising the Korean store didn't have a lot in stock!
On to Michael....one of the worst kept secrets on Lost! I was really hoping the PTB would throw us a shocker, they didn't! I hope there is some good explanation for it all.
The Captain is not to be trusted, according to the note Desmond and Sayid got, but if the note was from Michael,maybe we should trust him. After all, Michael isn't to be fully trusted if he's working for Ben.
I thought the trailer said "we find out who the "next" member of Oceanic 6 is" not the rest of the Oceanic 6, in this case, Sun, so it means there may still be one more to find out about. I still don't see that Aaron could count as one of them, but he may be counted if Kate says he's hers. But I agree that the media would be likely to count the baby, it would make for gripping news!
I forgot to mention, I still don't trust Juliet. It was AWFUL of her to tell Jin her "patients" secret. I think she only wanted to keep Sun around to keep an eye on her. Her sincerity was more to do with her Hippocratic oath that a real desire to be one of the Survivors.I promise to write an apology to Elizabeth Mitchell if I'm proven wrong!
ReplyDeleteAlso I missed Sawyer!!!
dansmot, thanks for clarifying what they said last week. I couldn't remember if they said the 'rest' or the 'next.'
ReplyDeleteIf Aaron doesn't count as an "Oceanic 6" member, than neither would Ji Yeon...just to clarify some comments on here.
I would love to think Walt is Kevin Johnson. Just because I think the reveal of Harold Perineau was done very sloppily. But it would not seem sloppy if this was the outcome.
Now that we've seen some more flashforwards, I'm definitely wondering now if Ben isn't the one in the coffin from last season. He would not be a friend of Jack's. He alone knows how to get back to the island (at least, I think he's the only one who knows), which would make Jack's devastation more understandable when he sees the obituary.
And we are all in agreement that Jack's flashforward from the season finale is placed way after the ones we have seen this season, right?
Ok, I haven't read each and every post, so someone may have thrown this out there already.
ReplyDeleteMy first thought about Jin is that somehow, he went back in time wher Sun went to the "present". So, he's really not dead, but stuck in the past somehow. ??
Ugh. Just more and more questions. I've got the episodeds dvr'd so I need to go back and watch again. LOVE this show!
I just posted a couple of new updates that hadn't occurred to me earlier. Let me know what y'all think.
ReplyDeleteRoland: I love that theory. I thought it might be Regina in the beginning, and then I'd forgotten about the bracelet by last night's ep.
dansmot: While I've said before that I hate when Damon and Carlton clarify things outside of the show, they were the ones who said we'd know all 6 by the end of episode 7. So that's why we're trying to figure out who they all are. :)
Kristin: Yes, Jack's flashforward definitely came after the rest. We know his is in 2007, and Sun would have given birth in 2005. I guess there's a small possibility that he shaved, quit the drugs, and got it together pretty quickly and then went to Kate's trial, but I doubt it.
Re: Naomi's braclet...in Sayid's flash forward in The Economist, the woman he takes up with, whose boss is "the economist" has a similar bracelet. I don't remember if it read the same as Naomi's. But couldn't RG just as easily refer to the ship's captain, Capt. Gault?
ReplyDeleteI'm pretty sure the promo said we'd find out the LAST Oceanic 6, which could be 1 or 2 people. My preference is that Aaron is 1 of the 6, and we found out the last 1, i.e., Sun.
I liked the episode, great credit to the writers. I also hope Jin is still alive on the Island.
One thing I don't think anyone has mentioned...there's a certain fertility doctor in Korea who knows Sun Kwon's husband was unable to father children. Sun in the future is famous as a menber of the O-6. So this doctor would know, or he would believe, that someone else fathered Ji Yeon. This may lead to suspicion later about the O-6 story. Maybe?
I don't think jonathan was kidding. this has been brought up in a few other forums.
ReplyDeleteI'm new to posting on this site, and I wanted to say "Hello" to my fellow slow-motion tv watchers. I hit the pause button, I think I'm going to wear it out. I wanted to know if anyone else wondered why Sun was packing a little travel suitcase in the beginning of her flashforward. I haven't seen any other post on the subject. I also don't think that Jin is dead. He's definitely still on the island. And Sun went to the grave with Hurley and the baby because she was being watched by her father's peons, and needed to act like the grieving widow. Just a thought
ReplyDeleteHey Nikki tell your hubby he has a good point about the tombstone! You should give him a guest spot for your blog :)
ReplyDeleteThis Jin is he or isn't he dead is driving me CRAZY! Either it will get resolved by next episode (if he indeed is the person who dies like the previews say) or it may bo on for a long time...I'm dying here!
Who says that Desmond and Faraday are the only two who can time travel? What if Jin's flashback was a time travel type and he was going back in time to find his Constant??? Perhaps he tries to get onto the boat to save Sun and then is told by Desmond he needs to find a Constant to live...but he cannot...
Ouch...my brain hurts...
Yea, more lima beans for me. Thanks, Nikki.
ReplyDeleteP.S. You're the first read I look for after the show.
I think that the obvious answer everything is that Ben is a shill for Wolfram and Hart. He brought a couple of the lawyers to the Island and now he's planted the doctor who upgraded Gunn's memories on the boat.
ReplyDeleteIsn't Zoe Bell even better known as the chick from Death Proof? Her car stunts are amazing.
What I want to know is: how much money did they pay Mark Messier to play the doctor on the ship? Did they have to buy him out of his potato chip contract?
ReplyDeleteMy theory on who counts as the Oceanic Six: Jack, Kate, Sayid, Hurley, Sun, and Aaron. Jack testified (lying under oath) that there were eight survivors of the crash, and two died. My theory - in the public lie that the Oceanic 6 tell the media - the two that survived the crash but died on the island, are Claire and Jin.
ReplyDeleteDamon and Carlton have also said somewhere (a podcast, I think) that the Oceanic 6 is just a public construct that the media makes about the survivors. This leads me to believe that it IS possible that there are others that make it off the island alive secretly who aren't counted as Oceanic 6. First, we already know that Ben is alive in the future, based on his flash-forward with Sayid. Second, I suspect that Michael made a deal with the devil (Ben) to get him and Walt off the island for good. That's why he's on the boat (to sabotage it and relay messages to Ben). If Michael survives all this and makes it off, which I think he will, then I also think that Walt makes it off the island. Michael's whole purpose for living is to be with this son. I don't think Michael would leave the Island without him; he would rather die. I am interested for the show to get back to Walt at some point - there's so much we don't know about him.
I'm also curious to find out about Desmond's future - does he make it off? If he's not part of the Oceanic 6 (which makes sense since he wasn't on the flight), then I hope that the writers find a way to reunite him with Penny. Please, Lost writers, give us one, just one relationship that survives this island! Charlie and Claire don't make it. Jack and Kate probably don't make it (according to the flash forwards). Kate and Sawyer probably don't make it (we have no indication that Sawyer leaves the island). Jack and Juliet probably don't make it (looks like Juliet is resigned to the fact that Ben won't let her leave). And now, this week, we find out that Sun and Jin don't make it, either. It's down to Rose and Bernard or Desmond and Penny! Also, I would add Paulo and Nikki as well as RG and Naomi as other Lost relationships that didn't make it past the island. Are the Lost writers anti-relationship? Do they hate happy endings? Give us just one, please!!
I also believe that Michael (neither friend nor family to Jack) will be revealed as the person in the casket (from New York). Call it a hunch.
Lastly, as much as I hate to admit it, I do think that Jin is really dead in the flash forward that we saw in the episode, Ji Yeon. I don't think Sun and Hurley could fake the emotions like that, if he were still alive. Prove me wrong, writers! Bring back Jin from the dead!
Love, love, love this show! It's the only one I watch in real-time and don't TiVo to watch later. I can't wait an extra minute to find out what happens. If this season of Lost doesn't garner a slew of Emmy's for the writers, producers, and cast then they will have been robbed because there's not another show on TV today that has this much quality writing, acting and suspense.
Keep up the great blog, Nikki. Look forward to your column each week after the show.
RE: your hubby's theory about Jin's gravestone:
ReplyDeleteNotice the details of the gravestone: first, there were the dates on the right side: 11.27.1974 (Jin's birthdate) and 9.22.2004 (Jin's 'alleged' date of death - the crash). Second, there were Korean words in the middle (most likely the family name). Third, there was a date on the right side, 3.20.1980. This is most likely Sun's birthdate. Notice how there is no date of death. We know that person is still alive.
This is a traditional family gravestone where the husband and wife are buried next to each other and listed on the same gravestone. So your husband was absolutely right - the tombstone had been erected before Sun actually returned! And when she returned and told the world that Jin was dead, they put his date of death as the crash.
Now whether he died in the crash or not is another story. I'm hoping he's still alive on the island.
I have to agree that jin is really dead. The writers wouldn't just say he's dead and then we find out he's alive. The thing I want to know is Jin one of the oceanic six or is it possibly Aaron? It said the last of the oceanic 6 would be revealed in the trailer, but all we know is that sun gets off the island. So who is the last one of the oceanic six?
ReplyDeleteRe: The Oceanic Six.
ReplyDeleteI think Darlton may have mislead us about knowing who the Oceanic Six where by the end of this episode to sell the Jin flashback as a flashforward. We only know five of the six so far, and the sixth will be revealed later.
Re: Ben's Spy
I'm not convinced the spy on the boat is Michael. I don't want to say who I think it is as its partially based on a spoiler I read, but I will say I think it is (A) Someone we (and Locke) already know and (B) Someone we (and Locke) think is dead.
Just to let everyone know that ABC put out two sneak peek for next week's show and one of the clips is on the freighter and the other is from John Locke's camp where he has gathered everyone to have Ben tell who his man on the boat is. Ben does say who it is to all of them at the end of the clip. If your interested check it out.
ReplyDeleteI like your column, but just to clarify, Regina wasn't Australian like the captain, she's from New Zealand.
ReplyDeleteAaron was not born until after the crash. Neither was Ji Yeon. So, if Åaron is considered an "Oceanic 6" member, then Ji Yeon would also have to be considered the same...but that would be seven survivors.
ReplyDeleteSo, I don't believe Aaron is considered an Oceanic 6 member.
I still go with the idea it's Michael who is number 6. If Lindelof said we'd find out by now...then it has to be a person from last night's ep. And the only other character who is 'off the island' is Michael.
I don't think any of the survivors are supposed to have 'happy' endings. Jack made that clear when he told Kate they never should have left. Crashing on the island was the best thing that happened to them. And leaving it is the worst.
I do hope that Penny and Desmond are allowed to have a happy reunion. Just one couple would satisfy me.
Karolyn: My guess is that Sun was packing for her stay in the hospital.
ReplyDeleteSince the last epsisode of the third season I have been convinced that Michael is the person in the casket and I still am.
So where is Ol' Smokey? The last time I remember seeing it was back in the third season, when Kate and Juliet where left behind by the Others. You think it'd take an interest in the new visitors to the island.
Crackedout: I too find it interesting that we haven't seen Smokey in awhile. Additionally I wonder if the writers hadn't totally worked out what Smokey really was at the beginnging of the show. Is the Smokey who grabbed the pilot and shredded his body the same Smokey that chased people in the forest and the same Smokey who killed Eko and Locke faced off with?
ReplyDeleteI have a feeling at the beginning they wanted a "Monster" but as the show has developed I see Smokey becoming more of a 'Island Spirit'.
I do find it a bit strange that the survivors now seem unafraid to walk alone through the forest when just weeks ago they all witnessed Smokey killing people and ripping trees out of the ground.
Does anyone else feel this was a 'not completely thought out' idea 3 years ago? I don't blame the writers for evolving a thought I just wish that they'd do something to explain such a drastic change. Would you go walking through that forest knowing what we all know?
A lot of us have been thinking for some time that maybe Widmore was responsible for the 'fake' crash site and we've been asking ourselves why and how.
ReplyDeleteIf I understood correctly, the Captain suggested that Widmore suspects it was faked, has poured a lot of cash into researching it and actually thinks Ben is behind the fake wreckage and also the 300+ dead bodies. I'm not sure we've ever talked here about that possibility have we? Has anyone here ever suggested that Ben planted the fake?
For me, I think this is the single biggest reveal for this week's show if I'm reading between the lines. Ben is metamorphing from the Hero and protector of the island to a radical, pathological Cult leader who's kill list just exploded to over 400 people.
WHO IS BENJAMIN LINUS??????
Matthew: I don't think Smokey was ever meant to be a monster. In the early episodes, Locke encounters it and describes it as "looking into the eye of the island," and later a "bright light." Hurley suggests that it might be a dinosaur, but that theory is promptly discarded by the others.
ReplyDeleteThat's not to say, however, that Smokey hasn't evovled over the four seasons....
Re Old Smokey. Any kind of science is way beyond me but could old Smokey be some sort of manifestation of the timeshift on the island? Is there any physical or chemical or even biological reason for such a thing? I leave it to those amongst us, (of which are many) with bigger brains than mine to figure it out!!
ReplyDeleteTo Anonymous (and whoever else might be interested)- I agree with your listing of the Oceanic 6 (Jack, Kate, Sayid, Hurley, Sun, Aaron). But I'm speculating that the other 2 who initially survived, according to Jack's bogus story told on the witness stand in Kate's trial, are Claire and Charlie. This idea comes from a poster on another blog, so it's not my original idea. Charlie has to be there because Penny spoke to him in the S-3 finale, and he told her "...I'm Charlie, Charlie Pace, I'm a survivor of flight 8-1-5, Oceanic...". Claire has to be there so Aaron can be born, and Aaron gets off the island.
ReplyDeleteI know other people have other theories, but I don't understand the explanations given as to why Aaron would NOT be one of the six. Kate survived the plane crash, and is found and rescued along with 5 others, according to the cover story. And this rescue would take place about 3 to 4 months after the crash, no longer than that, because otherwise Sun would die due to her pregnancy. So, if Aaron didn't come off the island with Kate, where did he come from? He's not on the passenger list, as has been pointed out, so unless he enters Kate's life after the rescue (?) he must have come home with her from the island. Why would the media, who invent the label "Oceanic 6", not count the baby as one of the six? (Eric, I'm in complete agreement with your earlier comment about Aaron, the media and the O-6.)
I'm not sure why there's so much resistance to Aaron as an Oceanic 6. The Eggtown promo said the next O-6 would be revealed. The promo for "Ji Yeon' said the last of the O-6 would be revealed, and Sun was revealed. I can't see how Michael's appearance as Kevin the ship's deck swabber is in any way a "revelation" that he's the final O-6. So the problem I have is that if you don't count Aaron, then there are only 5. But I appreciate the opinions of others. I guess I'm just acting like a lawyer (I'm not a lawyer) who's trying to win people over to my argument.
Nikki, I love your blog!
dansmot: That's really interesting. I think several have suggested that the whispers we hear might be the voices of those stuck in the teleportation or timeshifting that's going on. Whether they're stuck by choice or by accident, I wonder if at times Smokey could represent different beings 'stuck' or traveling. I remember in the very first episodes where the 'monster' was able to push trees apart and pull them out by the roots. I think when it mangled the Pilot we were all thinking some kind of invisible T-Rex.
ReplyDeleteIf Smokey is a manifestation of the island or maybe of the island's dead, then it could be different things at different times. A dead animal, person etc.
At one point I really felt Smokey represented 'what we fear most' and that seemed to be different for different people.
Then I thought it was the 'connector' to what each survivor needed to work out.
I'm still baffled by why Smokey pounded Eko to death.
Was anyone else creeped out by the obstetrician who delivered Sun's baby? Her real OB was reportedly away at a conference (how convenient), and I was afraid that the stand-in doc was going to steal Ji Yeon or something nefarious. He didn't seem to be a real doctor; like, less than one minute after he said he needed to do a c-section, Sun was crowning and then had the baby (which was SO CUTE, but the way). Maybe we'll see that "doctor" again an another FF?
ReplyDeleteI also loved good ol' Bernard's gentle heart-to-heart with Jin, and the beautifully written (and acted) reconciliation between Jin and Sun.
An earlier post referred to writing Emmys. I've been thinking that the Lost writers certainly deserve consideration for some Emmys this season. Does anyone know if there is an Emmy award for writing?
Now for a month of waiting! *sigh*
Okay I admit it...I was completely taken by surprise with Jin. My first thought and gasp moment: Oh no they di-in't! LOL
ReplyDeleteI started to get a sense that something was weird when he went back for another panda and with his anger. But I was too wrapped up in the excitement to catch it.
Yes, wonderful emotion in this episode. BUT, I am going to stand firm with others and say Jin is NOT dead. It makes complete sense to me that he was left behind...I would presume out of necessity or something. The date on the tombstone would support this. Also, when Hurley says to her "should we go see him?" I think this is the only place that Sun has to connect with Jin. I mean, if I left my husband behind and had to pretend he was dead, I would probably go to his "monument" like she did. I dunno. Just seems to fit that there are people who stay on the island. I'm holding out hope. :)
Agree, very anti-climatic with Michael. So...I'm wondering if the writers are ready to rip the rug out from underneath us as usual. Who knows.
I've lost count...is next week's the last one they filmed before the writers strike? Will there be a delay between the old and new episodes? *cries at the thought*
I too am so invested in this show. I live for it every week.
Related questions: I tried to see the clips for next week on ABC's website. I was able to see the widget one which is what they showed on TV. I can't see the other one. I still can't get those clips in the middle to show. I even re-installed Java to make sure it wasn't my computer. Anyone else have this problem?
Also, I tried going to find815.com and when you click to go into chapter 1, all the next page says is Loading and nothing else. Is something wrong with it? Now that I've decided to spend more time I don't have exploring these fun things, the sites won't work!? Just when I finally got all the items to fit in Sam's bag!!! Now I can't go anywhere with the password!! Can anyone help?
There is an award for writing at the emmys,(more than one actually)and lost has won writing awards for Season 1. The obstetrician was a little bit creepy, but I was more creeped out when Sun was shouting for Jin and a guy stopped and looked at her. It looked a lot like the person Jin gave the panda to in the flashback. Since I believe Jin is really dead, maybe that guy was somehow associated with Jin's death? But I think that when Jin got back to the island Paik or one of his associates killed him. If you remember the season finale back in Season 1, when Sun spilled water on him at the airport and he went to the bathroom, one of Paiks associates was there, saying that if he didn't continue working for Paik, he would kill him. So maybe right when the got off the island, one of Paik's associates found him and killed him, so he never saw the baby?
ReplyDeleteI have 2 questions and I'd love to hear what nikki thinks.
ReplyDelete1. Is Ben one of the oceanic 6?
( considering he was with Said )
2. Does the world at large know about the staged plane wreckage or do they still think the 6 survived the fake plane wreck?
jazzygirl: This weeks episode is that last one filmed before the writers strike. The next episode won't air to April 24.
ReplyDeleteI'm sure this has been thought of already but maybe Smokey is a Dharma experiment gone wrong.
ReplyDeleteIn season 1 Smokey takes a look at Locke, does nothing and leaves (I'm assuming this is what happens since we don't actually see it). At the end of season 1 it comes back and attempts to either take or kill Locke. Locke, idiot that he is, was ready to let Smokey do this but Jack saves him. In season 2 Smokey takes a look at Eko, does nothing and leaves. In season 3 Smokey returns and kills Eko. Back to season 1, if I remember correctly, Smokey gets a look at Kate. Back to season 3 and Smokey chases after Kate, along with Juliet. Maybe there's a pattern here. Maybe it analyzes a person then kills them later.
Aaron. Does he know who his real mother is? Did Kate adopt him or is she passing him off as her own? I'm guessing that a wanted fugitive would have a hard time adopting a child which leads me to believe that Kate is passing him off as her own. In order for this to work Kate would have to make up a story that she was one or two months pregnant when the plane crashed or she got pregnant on the island. If this is true then resuce couldn't occur for at least seven months. Kate's Mother's desire to see her Grandson leads me to believe that this may be true. She would also have to lie about his age which may be why she is sheltering him from everything.
If the later were true, that she adopted him, then maybe in the O-6 story Claire survives but dies during or after giving birth. That would be easy to explain without any modern technology to assist with the birth. Perhaps Jack was going to mention something to this effect in court and that's why Kate stopped his testimony.
I think Barry may be right about Charlie and Claire being the two who survived but died before rescue.
Here's what we know for sure: Jack, Kate, Hurley, Sayid, Sun, Aaron and Ben make it off the isalnd. Hurley and Sayid both stated that they were Oceanic Six. We know that Jack, Kate and Sun are Oceanic Six as well. This only leaves Aaron or Ben.
Did anyone else notice at the end of Eggtown that Aaron says "mummy" as opposed to "mommy"? I know that's how it'd sound with the accent, I just wondered if anyone else caught it.
Don't forget that when Lost returns it will be on an hour later due to the return of Ugly Betty and Grey's Anatomy. I wonder if they are going to do away with the enhanced episodes!
ReplyDeleteAbout Michael: Yeah we all guessed he was on the boat but I still think it's intriquing! How'd he get there? Where's Walt? Why is he still working for Ben?
ReplyDeleteI thought the scene with Michael, Sayid and Desmond was great. Yeah, it was a lame reveal but that doesn't take away from the look on Michael's face when he approaches Sayid and Desmond, head down and it seems he has a real hard time looking them in the face. And the looks on Sayid's and Desmond's faces also! Confusion and anger all rolled into one. I could tell that Sayid was just itching to get Michael alone. I think the performances by all involved in the scene make up for the reveal.
I feel bad for Michael. He was put into a terrible place. What parent wouldn't go to any extreme to save the life of their child? He could have gone about the whole situation in season 2 in a better way but he did what he felt he had to. He still cares about the other survivors. He told them he would bring help back to the island. He's been helping Sayid and Desmond on the boat. I don't honestly believe that anyone will ever forgive him for murdering Ana-Lucia and Libby and it's just one more thing that he's going to have to live with.
Here's my theory about next weeks episode. It'll begin with flashbacks but end on a flashforward. In the flashforward, Michael is off the isalnd and will be killed and we learn that he is the man in the coffin. The suprise comes when we learn that, on Ben's orders, Sayid is responsible for Michael's death.......LOST
Sorry guys, my brain is working overtime. So to continue with my last theory: Michael is already off the isalnd so he doesn't need to be rescued. All he's gotta do is finish doing what Ben needs him to do, help Sayid and Desmond then just leave with the freighter or get off of the freighter and find another way home. They can say that Michael Dawson died in the crash and he could live under the alias of Kevin Johnson, only those on the island would know. Ben probably has provided him with fake documentation identifying Michael as Kevin. Later on Michael becomes a liability to Ben, probably because Ben's trying to portect the isalnd and Michael has information about it, and Ben dispatches Sayid to kill him. No one cares Michael/Kevin is dead, except for Jack, and since no one knows that Kevin Johnson was on th e isalnd there's media attention about his death. Just that small article in the paper.
ReplyDeleteGreat site. Thanks for the insight on Lost. I'll be reading here every week.
ReplyDeleteJazzygirl: If you want to see the clips for next week I also found that if you go to Youtube.com and type in - Lost Season 4 episode 8 you should be able to pick from many of the same two sneak previews for episode 8.
ReplyDeleteI still am going with the theory that Widmore/Abbadon are bad and Ben (even though he has issues) is good. The six/five that were rescued seem to have someone they care about back left back on the island. I don't think that everyone is dead.
It seems to be the perfect insurance to keep the six from talking about what really went on. For Example, if Kate talks, then Sawyer/Clair dies. If Jack talks Clair dies(He'll find out she family). Sun talks then Jin dies. I have a feeling with Sayid that they have Nadia. If Michael is one of the people off the Island then his would be Walt. Hurly maybe the only one that I can't figure out but it would make sense that Jack was worried about him talking back in the season opener. Hurley often slips up and Jack probably got nervous after seeing him being chased by cops and then thrown into a mental facility.
What I really want to know is, if the plane on the ocean bed has the same number of all the passengers on the manifest, then how do the six explain how they're alive when they get back?
ReplyDeleteThough I know they will explain that, eventually.
The producers have confirmed (through dark UFO) that the "Oceanic 6" are: Jack, Kate, Sayid, Aaron, Sun and Hurley. The term "Oceanic 6" is a media term coined in order to make succinct headlines. It is not a list based on the manifest. Just imagine how such a story would be covered in the real world. Headlines are rarely literal.
ReplyDeleteWhat I mean is, there were a set number of passengers on the flight. I gather that number were accounted for in the plane in the ocean. So isn't there a discrepancy when more people than that number turn up alive?
ReplyDeleteI mean people from that number.
ReplyDeleteMy husband & I were apart when we watched 'Ji Yeon'. I was at our daughters' home watching her new baby & every time a commercial would come on he would call me! Then, we watched it recorded on our DVR tonite(Monday)& we always go 'WOW!Now, THAT is awesome!' It was great! I loved that I thought Jin & Sun were in the same 'flash forward' but it seems that Mr.Cuse & Mr. Lindeloff were up to their bag of cool tricks yet again! I do believe that Jin was having a flashBACK while Sun was having a flashFORWARD! Did it seem that way to anyone else? Can't wait for the repeat with the tidbits at the bottom of the screen!
ReplyDeleteI also read on the headstone that Jin was born in 1980? That would make him 24 in 2004. No way! He seems older than THAT! Maybe I looked at it wrong.
CANNOT, CANNOT, CANNOT wait til next week!!!
And,no~Michael does NOT have a twin brother! THAT was Michael! I think that Ben recruited him when he let him leave the island. Did you notice the way he looked at Jack when he left with Walt in the boat? Looking back, that was a 'don't worry, I'll be back to help you' look! Where is Walt? With Michael? Ooooh!
Sooooo many theories! I love it!!!
Til next time,
LoyallyLOST
"I also read on the headstone that Jin was born in 1980? That would make him 24 in 2004. No way! He seems older than THAT! Maybe I looked at it wrong."
ReplyDeleteCynthia, that was actually Sun's birthday. Jin's birthday was in 1974 - the second date on the tombstone.
The year of the dragon comment by the shopkeeper gave away the flashback for me - last year of the dragon was in 2000!
OK! Just got back from a weekend with the family (and no Internet) so back to responding to y'all.
ReplyDeleteBarry: Interesting thoughts on the bracelet (see my post update) and the fertility doc. You're right... he'd be a little suspicious, for sure, unless Paik found out that he'd gone behind his back to talk to Sun and sent him a little "message."
christemple: No, Jonathan was kidding. Trust me on that one (I think the panda comment was kind of a giveaway...)
Karolyn: Welcome! Good point, too. :)
Roland: Ah, my husband has his own blog. And he almost NEVER wants to discuss the show with me afterwards (he watches, it ends, he doesn't comment, and yet when I get him to, he always comes up with some brilliant idea like that one). He actually disliked the episode immensely, and said he felt manipulated and that the Jin flashback was stupid. Sigh.
Doe: Thanks! And if you like lima beans, we'd get along just fine in a bomb shelter! :)
redeem: LOL! And I should have qualified my comment... Bell is best known to ME as Lucy's stuntgal. :)
Chris: Your comment made me laugh out loud. Through the entire episode I kept thinking, "I know this guy from somewhere..." and now I'm POSITIVE that's who I was thinking of. I wonder what flavour of Lay's they have on the island. Ketchup? Smoky BBQ? Polar Bear?
Anonymous: I hope next time you post, you leave a real name! I loved your comments. I've been a hold-out on the whole 'Aaron is the sixth member' theory, but I think I'm convinced now. Eric had a hand in it, and now you've put forth the idea of the media construct. I'll have to just get of that scene in my head where the lawyer's acting like no one would know who Aaron is, and pretend that didn't happen, and then it makes sense. :)
ReplyDeleteI'm with you on Desmond. Love him. I couldn't handle it if they killed him.
Glad to see my hubby's hunch was right! I'd actually seen Sun's name on it when I watched it again, and he said, "Oh, then that's not right, because why would they be on the same stone?" and I explained that my grandparents are on the same stone, and it's actually common.
Brian: Interesting theory about being misled. I'm sure they'll come out soon and finally put our speculations to rest.
batcabbage: I know, and that's totally my bad (I'll actually post an update now). Someone else emailed me and I felt awful. Terrible mistake.
Kristin: Ok, I'm new to defending the idea that Aaron is the 6th (see all former posts by me) but now that I'm changing my mind, there's a difference between Aaron and Ji Yeon: Ji Yeon was born AFTER the rescue, and Aaron before. So if you take the idea that it's all a media construct, the media would have dubbed the 6 people returning from the island the Oceanic Six, regardless of whether they were on the plane, or in someone's womb. Ji Yeon wouldn't have counted, because she's still inside Sun... and, if the rescue happens soon, she won't be noticeable yet.
crackedout: I agree about the packing (Sorry I didn't answer that, Karolyn). I was going to pose that as a question, too, but then I thought, "Hmm... she's probably just packing her hospital bag." But then, that raises a new question: Why does she act like the labour pains are entirely unexpected, and that "something is wrong"? That line still baffled me. "OHMYGOD, what is this PAIN I'm having? Let's see... my last health checkup was fine, I haven't had any headaches lately, for some reason I haven't had a period in months so it couldn't be that... hmm... I have NO IDEA why I'm having these pains!!" Duh.
MatthewD: Yes, the smoke monster seems to be gone now. I, too, wonder if it hadn't been completely thought out, but by season 2, when it flashed the pictures at Eko, I think it was. I simply believe it's a manifestation of Jacob (or the island is creating both as manifestations) and in that case, we could have last seen Old Smokey as Walt appearing to Locke, or even the people in the cabin. It's hard to say.
Barry: Good point on the 2 people who were in Jack's fake survival story. I agree. Obviously Claire has to be one of them...
ReplyDeleteBut as I suggested in my article, wouldn't there be 3? Think about the math: He said there were 8 survivors of the crash, but only 6 got rescued. If Aaron is one of the 6, he was born after the 8. So... 8 people survived. One is born, making it 9. Six return to the real world, so that means 3 died. THAT is the other reason why I didn't think Aaron was one of the 6, and was smuggled, because Jack actually says at one point (I think) that 2 died. Not 3.
Hmm... am I moving away from my Aaron theory already? It all comes back to the Kate episode. Maybe in the opening to my column next week I'll list the reasons why people are resistant to Aaron being the 6th. That said, I think it's the only possibility at this point, and don't buy that it's Michael. I think he gets off, but I think he does so secretly.
dansmot and Matthew: I like the idea that the voices are people caught between times!
Pete: I was TOTALLY creeped out by that guy. I was saying so to my husband when we were watching. First, he walks into the room and says, "Nurse, give her some medication." Uh... so much for a natural birth?? Why not give the poor woman a choice before medicating her?? Sheesh. Then he says we need to go to a c-section, and acts like he's going to wheel her away right this very second, but she hasn't had a proper epidural by the looks of it (she's moving around like she's not numb) and then the baby comes out about 15 seconds later. It was ridiculous. I, too, wondered why her regular doctor was gone.
HEY! This could come back to that other comment where someone mentioned the fertility doctor who knows the truth about Jin. Could they be one and the same, and he's missing under strange circumstances?
Another thing I wanted to know is, where does Paik factor into all of this? Sun goes right back to Korea. Is Paik still around? Where was he at the birth? Why doesn't he have armed guards surrounding her at all times? He seemed a little hands-off.
jazzygirl: I agree about the monument having special significance, and being the only way Sun can connect. Sorry, I can't help you with the ABC site; I find it wonky as hell.
ekrs: No, Jin wouldn't have been one of the Oceanic Six and then killed by Paik upon his return, or his tombstone would have had a different date on it.
I have 2 questions and I'd love to hear what nikki thinks.
ReplyDelete1. Is Ben one of the oceanic 6?
( considering he was with Said )
2. Does the world at large know about the staged plane wreckage or do they still think the 6 survived the fake plane wreck?
***
Good questions! I don't think Ben is one of the 6. I think I'm turning around to the Aaron theory, as much as I disagree with it, but I don't think Ben could fake that, even with all his passports. I also think, as we saw this week in the captain scene, that Ben is too closely linked to the fake plane crash site to have put himself in the media spotlight. I think the way he appears to Sayid, alone in a darkened room like some ghoul, that he's left the island mysteriously and is not one of the 6.
I'm assuming there will be some sort of cover-up on the staged plane crash. It became a media sensation that this plane had gone down and taken 324 people with it, so to suddenly say that 8 people survived it would be huge, and if the world thought it was a cover-up, they'd probably never take planes again. So I think they'll have to say something like, "Well, there WERE 8 people missing, we miscounted" or something like that. But it'll be a lot more interesting than that, and I can't wait to find out what happens in that situation.
Brian: No, actually, they filmed 8 before the Writer's Strike. Next week is a new episode.
Crackedout--I did notice that Aaron said "mummy" not "mommy", but I guess I didn't give it much thought, I was too OMG with the Aaron reveal. But, good point.
ReplyDeleteNikki--I rewatched part of "Eggtown". At the trial, in Jack's testimony, Kate cuts him off just after he said something like: "...the other 2 didn't...".
Right there she cut him off, maybe because had he continued, he would have brought up Aaron, or he might have gotten into areas they're not supposed to talk about. The only way I see out of your math problem, isthat Claire counts as 2 of the 8. And this is what Kate does not want Jack to talk about. Maybe? It's a theory :)
Crackedout: Canadians tend to say "mummy," too. So maybe it will reveal that Kate really IS a Canuck! ;)
ReplyDeleteNikki: When I said "this week," I meant in the sense of "this coming week," although I can definately see how it might be misconstrued.
ReplyDeleteAs to Sun's birth, I will add that I was suposed to be a C-section birth, but ended up being a natural birth instead. It only took 30 min (my mom was really popular in the maternity ward, and I'd imagine this blog as well).
Also, does anyone else thin Aaran and Ji Yeon are going to get together in the future and have super island babies?
"Also, does anyone else thin Aaran and Ji Yeon are going to get together in the future and have super island babies?"
ReplyDeleteLost: The Next Generation.
HA! Followed by: Deep Space Lost
ReplyDeleteAs I sat and watched the 2nd EP this season where we saw the subs searching the ocean floor, not once did I ever think that what I was watching was real. It looked very real, as did the TV news broadcast etc. But not once did I think the producers actually put an entire plane full of dead people on the bottom of the ocean.
ReplyDeleteMy point here is, the Sunda Trench is miles below the ocean surface which will make any recovery next to impossible. Didn't I read that it may be the 2nd deepest place on the earth?
Even in 2004 they had the cenematic capabilities to visually fake a plane wreck. While Ben or whoever might have the money and power to really put a plane full of people on the bottom of the ocean floor, isn't it more likely and much less expensive that the whole thing was created in a editing studio somewhere and handed to the news media.
CNN doesn't have subs. Even Geraldo Rivera would take months if not years to put together a conspiracy buster team to go find the wreck. Its always seemed to me like they found it way too quickly. Its different when there's pieces of the plane floating in the water, but what we saw is a mostly intact plane on the bottom.
So here I go. I'm gonna say that the entire wreck is a production by someone. They could put the studio on the boat and combine it with previously recorded stuff and easily make it look like the pictures were coming straight from the ocean floor.
Another thing... wouldn't a plane flying from Sydney to L.A. fly east of Australia? The Sunda trench is in the Indian Ocean northwest of Australia. Since Kate's trial I've wondered how they'll reconcile published video from the Indian Ocean with Jack's words "We crash landed on a South Pacific Island".
The Captain's Black Box could easily be the flight recorder from any plane used as a manipulation tool.
Its all a fake! It makes much more sense than a cloned plane, a time shifted plane or another entire plane of dead people. It could eventually be discounted as a hoax to get money from Oceanic Airlines by some radical group. Remember Frank said, "That's not the pilot". Someone faking the video might know what the pilot looked like but wouldn't know about his wedding ring.
Hey Niki,
ReplyDeleteI me and my family are big fans of your blog and really enjoy reading it every week
My comment is that I noticed that the man that walks by sun in the hospital is also one of the survivors of 815. Now I'm not sure is this is a CE or an easter egg of some kind
I am a memeber on www.4815162342.com and I posted this on there in more detail.
http://www.4815162342.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=47660
hope you can check it out.
Mabye he's number 6??
Matthew: Beautiful theory. Sometimes in the moment of trying to figure out what's happening in one episode, we forget what we've already been shown, and you're right, we should go back and look at the original finding. I love it.
ReplyDeleteCalvin: What a great catch!! I love stuff like this. I'll bet he's an extra they've used again, but then again, I LOVE finding extras showing up off the island. The morgue doctor who takes Jack to see his "dead" father, for example, is seen wandering around the wreckage after the crash. Same goes for the old man that Eko killed as a boy so Yemi wouldn't have to. Probably just a re-use of extras, but I'd love to think it isn't. Awesome find!!